Having started a site about music and fitness, it's pretty easy to guess that those are two of my major interests. There's another topic that interests me almost as much, one that has popped up in my writing here from time to time: politics. I am an avid follower of politics. I read political news every single day, I have worked on a few political campaigns, and my day job is in the public sector. While I understand why many people find politics exhausting or disinteresting, I genuinely believe that the world would be a better place if people were more involved in the mechanics of how their communities operate. Given this interest, I was pretty excited to talk to a band with an unquestionably political album on the way. That album is People as Idiots & Idiots as Leaders, and from Austria's hardcore punk band Desolat. Head into the pit to read my conversation with Desolat's vocalist and guitarist, Alfred Satani. It has been lightly edited for grammar. 

Let's start with a simple one before moving onto the big questions: Who are your musical influences, and how would you describe Desolat's sound?

We all originate from the punk and hardcore scene. But we developed our musical preferences over the years. What brings us together in this band is noise rock, sludge, hardcore and a bit of death metal and emocore I would say. Bands we like are Bongzilla, Melvins, Isis, Neurosis, Lvmen, Iron Monkey, Entombed, Minor Threat, Dead Kennedys, Jesus Lizard, Sonic Youth, Amenra, Helmet, Couch Slut, Nomeansno, and Lard. I’m sure everyone has to add a few. We don’t set any boundaries to what we do and like to describe ourselves as 90s band because that’s the era when we all were young and got mainly socialized musically.

Okay, onto the big ones. There has been so much discussion in the last few weeks about musicians sharing their political views: This is a very opinionated album, so obviously none of you are shy about sharing your views. Is music an inherently political artform?

Well, everything is political, our mere existence is. So music is somehow as well. But I wouldn’t say it is an “inherently political artform”. Music is so often just joy, fun, emotions, entertainment. But I was strongly moved by a political musical scene since my youngest age. Be it political songwriters like Billy Brag or Woody Guthrie, old school hardcore from the USA like Black Flag, Minor Threat, or Dead Kennedys, and the anarcho-punk/crust scene of the 90s, with favorite bands of mine like Detestation, Hiatus, Aus-Rotten, Dystopia, etc. I would say the first really enormously important band to me were Bad Religion and they are very political. Also Deutsch-Punk here in Austria and Germany was very formative. Bands like Toxoplasma, Graue Zellen, Slime, or Dritte Wahl were full of political, left-wing phrases, often not very deep but very appealing to angry teens. The punk scene was always a musical, cultural and political movement. Jello Biafra and Greg Graffin were very formative heroes to me.

Why do you think some musicians are so afraid to share their political views?

I wouldn’t say they are generally afraid. It depends on how controversial a topic is. Also commercial artists like to share their political views when they are sure the majority of the ones they address agree with them. Often it feels even like a promotional tool when they want to show they are on the good side. Virtue signaling it’s called. Just look at the Grammy ceremonies. Liberal consent topics are fine for commercial artists and huge companies as well. It’s different on more controversial or more radical topics. When it comes to Antifa or identification with more radical or revolutionary groups and ideas it might be a different thing. (Of course this wasn’t the case till 30 years ago. But as our album tells, it’s going down.) If musicians want to appeal to a wider audience they might take care not to scare too many people off. Of course the Israel-Palestinian war is a perfect example now for a troublesome development, it’s very controversial, positions are hardened and musicians who look at their career in the first place don’t know what to do. People are so mad about this, I understand it can be confusing and scary.

We're heading into election season in the United States, so "Idiots as Leaders" feels very timely. While it's a pretty venomous song, the verse suggests you think people have the power to change the course of a society. Do you feel like people are preparing to rise up against our idiot leaders?

Unfortunately I absolutely don’t think so. I have the feeling people become more idiotic than ever, driven by greed, hatred, fear, envy, laziness, lack of education, fear of relegation, fear of loss of significance especially by white people and men, as always rascism, xenophobia, etc. So they vote for idiots. Democracy devalues itself and we might wake up in authoritarianism. I guess we all know this movie Idiocracy. it’s very underrated and the perfect satire on what’s going on.

Please take this opportunity to share some thoughts about the elected leaders anywhere on the planet who you think are the most awful. I know there are plenty to choose from!

Your guy up front is number one, Trump of  course. He has such a huge global impact, on concrete policy but also as a role model for right-wing populists and wannabe authoritarians worldwide. His best buddies Victor Orban from Hungary and Bolsonaro from Brazil are gone now, but Milei from Argentina or Erdogan from Turkey are still here and many are pawing at the starting blocks. The right-wing extremist parties AfD in Germany and FPÖ in Austria are number one at the polls here meanwhile. The future might be fun. 

Putin might not serve as an example for a political leader of a democracy in decline any more as Russia is a full authoritarian system at war meanwhile. As are the leaders of dictatorships like North Korea or Myanmar.

In true punk tradition, this album pretty directly calls out politicians, tech billionaires, social media personalities, and other the generally self-obsessed. Can you tell us more about how these people and the issues they cause inspired this album?

When an outspoken political billionaire like Elon Musk bought Twitter it made perfect sense. To rebuild it to serve him as huge media outlet for his personal beliefs and aims. Those people don’t hide anything, they talk about their vision of a libertarian plutocracy and them as the leaders. People like Peter Thiel and Musk are so ridiculously rich, they are a serious threat to democracy. It’s very scary.

How did your PR rep respond to the song "The Art of Shit" and the lyrics that call out PR people?

It’s an antagonistic topic because also we as a band, as musical artists, want to promote our work. On the other hand we call out promotion and promoters. Dave from Earsplit PR who is a very competent and lovely guy was kind enough to just ignore it. I also think he’s got other things to do. Also the song is not all too serious and was more inspired by the promotion and traditions of high culture, fine arts, and experimental art. The mechanisms of the art business serves as playground especially for rich people, for investment and to give the impression of being cultured and intellectual. And of course the self-promotion of artists, especially in times of social media. So often many of those intellectual bingo bullshit phrases that give an impression of great deepness are not more than GG Allin screaming “Fuck the system.” It’s a massive charade. But you are right, it’s contradictory as we also promote our music and you could read it as insult on our promoter. It’s not too serious. Please love us, haha!

Before we go any further down this direction, I want to point out that the album does have an element of playfulness to it. "Cyberdyne Employment Application" is a great song title. Should listeners take your lyrics at face value, or is a little bit of reading between the lines required?

Thank you very much! You are the first to mention it! I’m very proud of this title! I would not say we are too deep, also we do not have very long and explorative lyrics and also we are not too serious at all and have a sense of humor. The quality of the lyrics and the topics is much higher here on this new album now, but we are still not Jello Biafra or Greg Graffin. We were inspired by our times to do so now. But also this can change again in the future and we might scream about tanks rolling over dead bodies - I just love when my favorite band Bolt Thrower does so.

How did Jarboe get involved in the album? How about the other guests?

Jarboe did a remix for my other band Phal:Angst a few years before, so I already was in contact with her. I love Swans, her solo work and especially her collaboration album with Neurosis. The latter are a major impact on our band stylistically. So this made sense in our head. So I asked her and she immediately agreed, she seems to be very easy going. 

RBK von Rolltreppe is a friend, she was the cover model on our last album “Get Sick…”, played bass in my other band Phal:Angst and is the singer of this great local post punk band Rolltreppe here. We love this band and she did something in the vein of that. 

Michael Masen is one of the most prolific free jazz saxophone players of the open scene with an open mind in Austria, he also did a feature on our last album, meanwhile he’s a friend and we just love the combination of heavy, distorted noise rock and free jazz saxophone improvisation madness, it’s a perfect fit. He also plays live with us.

In theory, we write about both metal and fitness on this site. Who in the band is the most interested in fitness, and what is his favorite exercise or routine?

That’s clearly our drummer Mentl. He even ran half-marathon races, runs and goes to the gym. I love hiking and did some bits of kickboxing in my past.

Desolat's People as Idiots & Idiots as Leaders is out on October 16 via Reptilian Records.